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welcome to need to know today's show is\h
loaded with content we'll be starting off\h\h

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with some thoughts about the war in ukraine\h
we'll do some uap news and updates and then\h\h

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we'll shift into the core of today's show\h
which is my co-host ross colthardt's book\h\h

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in plain sight now i know he's\h
done a lot of interviews about\h\h

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it but i want to ask him some questions i\h
haven't really heard him get asked about\h\h

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and in any case that book really took the uap\h
world by the lapels last year and gave it a\h\h

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good strong shake myself i've read ross's book\h
in three formats now that would be soft cover\h\h

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ebook and then listening to a once on audible this\h
leads me to conclude that raj should probably be\h\h

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interviewing me about his book but whatever let's\h
say you rosco let me apologize in advance to all\h\h

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of our listeners and to you bryce for my appalling\h
american accents in the uh audible edition\h\h

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i uh i i think i was rather ruthless in taking off\h
tom de long i i portrayed him rather unfortunately\h\h

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as a 12 year old boy getting very very excited to\h
be honest with you i thought all the voices were\h\h

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really kind of charming in their own way and and\h
if if we were to have any match-up between your\h\h

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american accent and my australian you would still\h
win hands down so don't don't apologize too much\h\h

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it's a very grim week though my friend isn't it\h
mike yeah can you believe that we're looking at\h\h

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a land war in europe in the 21st century i just\h
i'm just so upset about it i know um i'm kind of\h\h

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curious uh about your specific thoughts about that\h
i've been thinking about it all this week because\h\h

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you've covered foreign wars you've been in iraq\h
and and i believe afghanistan you've been these\h\h

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places tell us what's going through your mind\h
right now look i've got really strong memories of\h\h

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an incident that i covered in dora which is a\h
suburb of baghdad shortly after the invasion\h\h

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in 2003 and there was a cluster bomb canister\h
that had been dropped by america on a suburban\h\h

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neighborhood in dora and these are bombs that\h
have been dropped by the russians all over town's\h\h

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cities across ukraine now and what we saw there\h
was just it's too horrendous to talk about i mean\h\h

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these things devastate civilian communities uh\h
it's appalling that they are still being used\h\h

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in warfare and other weapons like thermobaric\h
weapons thermobaric bombs that literally suck\h\h

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the oxygen out of the air these are cruel\h
weapons to use on civilian populations\h\h

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i mean i vladimir putin is doing something\h
that i never contemplated we would see in the\h\h

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21st century i i thought as primitive humans were\h
at least beyond that and that we've learned how to\h\h

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settle our differences with negotiation but we're\h
still primitive apes you know i guess that's true\h\h

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and at the same time i also had to recoil just\h
on a very visceral level when i heard him talking\h\h

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or at least threatening the possible use of\h
nuclear weapons or at least putting them on\h\h

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a higher alert status that's just been kind of\h
the uh the third rail of of war you just don't\h\h

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talk about that stuff so it kind of frightened\h
me and i i don't know how that play on your side\h\h

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well it's clearly an effort to try and stop the\h
americans and the nato partners from intervening\h\h

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uh because of course the one thing that could\h
stop vladimir putin would be european and\h\h

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american air power but of course the moment that\h
happens it's every likelihood that we would be\h\h

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involved in a third world war the terrible\h
thing bryce is i mean i've been reading\h\h

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particularly some british intelligence\h
commentators who are speaking on some of the more\h\h

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specialized websites uh security and risk\h
groups and they're talking about how this\h\h

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is essentially a third world war already\h
because there's already a cyber war underway\h\h

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and the risk i don't think people realize just how\h
dangerous a situation we're in at the moment the\h\h

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bulletin of atomic scientists which you've got\h
the doomsday clock on their website for years\h\h

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since the cold war it's measured the proximity of\h
nuclear conflagration and we are at this moment\h\h

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closer to a nuclear conflagration to all our\h
third world war nuclear war than at any other\h\h

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time in cold war history we're a hundred seconds\h
to midnight and there's just you know the risk\h\h

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of say for example what happens if a a polish\h
jet strays across into the ukraine border and\h\h

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uh it's engaged with by the russians and shot\h
down then there's an obligation on nato to respond\h\h

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and then i i think the risk of escalation is\h
enormous we are in uncharted territory and in\h\h

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incredibly dangerous times and i guess i guess for\h
yourself and myself we feel like we've grown up in\h\h

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dangerous times i mean i remember my family had a\h
a shelter a basement that we turned into a fallout\h\h

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shelter a fat lot of good it would have done but\h
then you know here i am uh many years later living\h\h

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in los angeles which not only is a target of uh\h
north korea if they decide to lob one over here\h\h

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but would clearly be one of the first targets in\h
any any russian uh and american conflagration so\h\h

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we do live in very troubling times and i find\h
myself you know to relate it back to our uh\h\h

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particular show here talking about the uap issue i\h
i kind of wonder if if the evidence is that there\h\h

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is another intelligence a non-human intelligence\h
interacting with us observing us watching us\h\h

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i i do really kind of wonder what they might be\h
thinking and and i don't think it's it's time for\h\h

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that usual joke where why would they even bother\h
with us we're such a you know violent whatever\h\h

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i mean clearly they've been interested in\h
us for a while and they've been interested\h\h

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in our nuclear weapons if you look back on on\h
many of the incidents that have happened so\h\h

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as they look at this right now i think as i sort\h
of read some of the things that people are talking\h\h

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about in twitter and about this and so forth and\h
articles there is there's one school of thought\h\h

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that says well they would shut it down well maybe\h
and then there's a lot of people will hope they do\h\h

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i hope they do my friend i i would that\h
would be good i'm i think i think you\h\h

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and i are agreed that the implications of what\h
the american government has officially conceded\h\h

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and the statements from so many senior\h
officials make it very very clear that there is\h\h

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there is an advanced technologically advanced\h
civilization that's operating on this planet that\h\h

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that is capable of technology that we do not yet\h
comprehend some frankly not our nuclear capability\h\h

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yeah and they are they apparently seem to be\h
concerned the evidence overwhelmingly the data\h\h

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points that they're looking at our nuclear weapons\h
so let me just thank you i really do hope they\h\h

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intervene uh well yeah i'm not counting on that\h
and i don't i don't plan on it i also think it's\h\h

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interesting that june 25th report from last year\h
said basically that the phenomenon was real it\h\h

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said that these uh objects were not likely made in\h
america and it kind of left the door open a little\h\h

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bit that well maybe they're russian or chinese do\h
the russians have any drones that are effective uh\h\h

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currently operating in ukraine and if they had\h
drones that worked like these uap wouldn't they\h\h

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already have rolled those out and wouldn't we be\h
thinking about rolling ours out if any either side\h\h

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had that kind of advanced tech ah absolutely mate\h
that is the nail on the head i mean if the only\h\h

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drones that appear to be operating successfully\h
inside the ukraine at the moment are the turkish\h\h

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drones that have been provided to the ukrainians\h
they've been obliterating convoys of russian armor\h\h

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uh it's very gratifying to see frankly i mean i\h
feel sorry for the poor russian boys underneath\h\h

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it who are unwittingly being dragged into this\h
war by this lunatic but um yeah i mean frankly\h\h

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we've been told that it's possible that\h
the technology that we're seeing in the\h\h

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in the atmosphere is uh possibly russian possibly\h
chinese drones i'm seeing no evidence that russia\h\h

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has any such technology and they don't seem to\h
be even able to resupply a convoy at the moment i\h\h

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mean they are suffering enormous setbacks in their\h
efforts to get to kiev i only hope that continues\h\h

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and frankly they don't even seem willing to\h
deploy their air force because they seem nervous\h\h

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about the stinger missiles that the uh allies\h
have given to the ukrainians so i should sure\h\h

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i don't see any evidence of drones i sure wish\h
this wasn't happening it would make it a lot\h\h

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easier uh to talk about the uap issue because you\h
could say well we seem to have our act together\h\h

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now maybe we can think about talking\h
to whoever it is that's out there\h\h

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but we clearly don't have our act\h
together and that's a little troubling\h\h

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uh you know let's move let's move forward we we\h
always like to do in our first segment some uap\h\h

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updates and and news and uh one of the ones i\h
just wanted to touch on because it's just such an\h\h

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incredible developing story is the the man who\h
was going to take over as the inspector he's been\h\h

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nominated by biden to be the inspector general\h
for the defense department this is a man named\h\h

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robert storch he was testifying at his his hearing\h
and senator kristen gillibrand just excoriated the\h\h

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guy scored one of the most incredible responses\h
i just have to read this for people first she\h\h

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asked him you know is it your position that as\h
you know that you would be looking into this\h\h

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as we've directed and he professed twice\h
that he really didn't know much about uap\h\h

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and yeah he would he would get around to it after\h
he was confirmed all right he she basically asked\h\h

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twice he basically said i'll get around to it\h
after i'm confirmed twice and she said well and\h\h

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this is a quote since you aren't familiar can\h
you please familiarize yourself with this issue\h\h

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and respond to these questions in writing before\h
your confirmation please i i just do your homework\h\h

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ladies and gentlemen the man had a two-word\h
answer it was kind of shocked and then he said\h\h

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uh yes ma'am and i thought what a great moment in\h
history that is a top moment in uap history for me\h\h

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well i mean i just think it's i but frankly i'll\h
say it i think it's appalling that somebody was\h\h

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coming in for a confirmation hearing to be\h
involved in such a crucial oversight role and\h\h

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they had no bloody idea that the biggest story of\h
all time has been unfolding inside the portfolio\h\h

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that they're administering so frankly i think\h
a lot of bureaucrats are going to have to pull\h\h

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their heads in and start applying their noses\h
to the wheel and actually understand this issue\h\h

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i mean i'm really gratified actually bryce because\h
just this week the um the other big story was the\h\h

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canadian government's released an enormous amount\h
20 years worth of ufo reports and it was about\h\h

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500 plus reports 300 pages sightings from\h
commercial pilots soldiers and police officers and\h\h

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it's a great story by vice news daniel\h
otis who's a great digger in canada\h\h

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he's been digging into this story and there's\h
some really interesting reports among them the uh\h\h

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as recently as last year there was a canadian\h
military flight that spotted a bright\h\h

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green flying object that flew into a cloud\h
and then disappeared over eastern canada\h\h

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numerous sightings by uh commercial pilots and\h
military pilots in canada and i think what's\h\h

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really interesting that the theme that daniel's\h
hit on is that there's a definite reluctance\h\h

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to report stuff but even if you accept that\h
reluctance you know it's quite clear people have\h\h

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been so concerned about what they saw that they've\h
come out and actually uh reported it and there's a\h\h

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there's one particular report i wanted to talk\h
about that back in 20 2018 in the bay of fundy\h\h

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yarmouth nova scotia um there was a a light yellow\h
steady and hovering high above the atlantic ocean\h\h

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and it was correlated by radar from norad and\h
the royal canadian air force and there were\h\h

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three primary radar hits that correlated\h
to the time and location of the sighting\h\h

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and so this is really interesting because this is\h
where the shag harbor incident happened in 1967\h\h

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and it really does beg the question are\h
these objects more underwater than we realize\h\h

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boy the shag harbor incident really does\h
ask that question because that's what it was\h\h

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all about people reported seeing it in going\h
into the water and that's pretty crazy stuff\h\h

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this is a great article there are lots of great\h
you know kudos to the canadians for uh at least\h\h

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having a freedom of information act that that\h
actually is working quite well right now and\h\h

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getting these reports out and just to underline it\h
for people it's on vice news and the name of the\h\h

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reporters daniel otis and what's really\h
interesting you can get a flavor of some of the\h\h

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actual documents and you can just see how these\h
are meticulously gathered over time and the fact\h\h

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that so many of them is very interesting and also\h
you can find the links to read more of them which\h\h

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if you're if you're into that kind of\h
thing it's a great great thing go ahead\h\h

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and crucially bryce the thing that i find\h
fascinating is the canadian air force was one\h\h

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of the air force in the in the five eyes alliance\h
that was basically saying no no these aren't a\h\h

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national security issue they're not raising any\h
issues of concern that was the public position\h\h

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of the canadian american british and australian\h
air force and the u.s air force for decades and\h\h

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these documents show they underline what you\h
and i both know that it's just a blatant lie\h\h

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they've been monitoring this phenomena for years\h
for decades and they have been concerned about\h\h

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it because by definition any incursion of an\h
unknown object into the airspace of any country\h\h

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any sovereign nation is a breach of that\h
airspace and a threat to national security\h\h

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yeah and to say so emphatically over the years\h
that there's nothing to see here and no no reason\h\h

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to be worried has not been very forthcoming and\h
those days may be ending if certain senators\h\h

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uh like gillibrand and rubio and the and many\h
of the others who have come out on this topic\h\h

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have their way they're going to insist\h
and you know just to wrap up this segment\h\h

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there's also a lot of news i mean lou elizondo\h
never seems to fail to go on a podcast without\h\h

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making podcast news and he's done it again of\h
course because he's saying that things are are\h\h

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going very very quickly in dc and it kind of goes\h
with a liberation times article that i i read last\h\h

152
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week where they were basically saying that the\h
people like gillibrand who are behaving the way\h\h

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that she just did with the ig nominee are doing so\h
because you know the public we got the nine page\h\h

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report they got an extra some 68 pages i think 64\h
pages and they've been briefed and shown the good\h\h

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stuff and as i always like to say they came out\h
with their hair on fire on this thing and they\h\h

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want to get something privileged yeah i've been\h
privileged to speak to some of the staffers and\h\h

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one or two of the congressmen or senators who've\h
basically heard these briefings and i i can tell\h\h

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you they are they were rattled by what they heard\h
they've seen some of these videos and i can't wait\h\h

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if and when it happens for the public to see the\h
same yeah i think i think it is game changing uh\h\h

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is the game completely changed yet no but it\h
does appear to be changing um so that's you\h\h

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know that's kind of the week in review kind of\h
thing for us let's let's move ahead one thing we\h\h

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also like to do is we like to add corrections and\h
additions when they're needed and you know it's\h\h

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interesting you told a great story about daniel\h
sheehan a few years a few episodes back uh the\h\h

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lawyer who actually saw a crash retrieval while\h
he was working for the carter administration and\h\h

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then we've also talked about lou elizondo so many\h
times i just thought we should point out to people\h\h

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that unless i'm mistaken daniel sheehan is also\h
lou elezano's attorney right now is that right\h\h

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that's right and actually i should acknowledge one\h
thing as well somebody picked me up on something\h\h

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i'd confused two previous podcasts i'd heard\h
of john ramirez the former cia analyst and i'd\h\h

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said that john was told certain things in a skiff\h
that he was talking about in the podcast that i\h\h

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was listening to it was actually a conversation\h
with senior cia colleagues in a hotel room uh\h\h

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not not an official briefing given in a clef\h
classified read-in situation inside a skiff\h\h

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and i'm happy to clarify that as well i i think\h
that's a good thing that we're doing and i like\h\h

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to keep doing it all right so listen we're going\h
to wrap up our our first segment here and uh when\h\h

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we come back boy do we have a surprise it's that\h
guy on the other side of the screen only this time\h\h

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i get to ask him questions make him a guest on his\h
own show which i think ought to be a lot of fun\h\h

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for us so when we come back we'll be getting\h
into some of those specifics about ross's book\h\h

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in plain sight and some of how he actually did\h
acquire some of that information and do some of\h\h

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those interviews so be right back kramer now via\h
webex let me recognize senator gillibrand please\h\h

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thank you so much mr chairman and welcome to\h
all our nominees um uh first for mr storch\h\h

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um mr storch in your current position as nsa\h
inspector general are you familiar with the\h\h

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dod's ig's ongoing assessment of the response from\h
dod components to the intrusions of unidentified\h\h

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aerial phenomenon into controlled dod airspace\h
as well as uap activity around naval and air\h\h

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operations further do you think the nsa has\h
been responsive to the dod's ig inquiries

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uh thank you for the question senator i'm afraid\h
that's not an issue with which i am currently\h\h

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familiar however if confirmed i certainly am\h
uh willing to look into that and to um take\h\h

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any action that's appropriate well thank you\h
um and if confirmed can i have your commitment\h\h

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to sustain this comprehensive assessment\h
until it reaches its appropriate conclusion\h\h

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including the possibility of follow-on actions\h
such as audits or investigations if the assessment\h\h

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recommends as much well again i honestly\h
am not familiar with that particular review\h\h

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but as is typical i think across the ig community\h
when a new ig comes in if their pending matters\h\h

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those would continue in in the office and it\h
would be perfectly appropriate to examine them\h\h

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um and if i am confirmed i can assure you that\h
anything that's pending went out in the office\h\h

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i'll i'll give my best attention to and if there's\h
appropriate follow-up to be done we'll do it\h\h

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okay so since you are familiar can you\h
please familiarize yourself with this issue\h\h

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and respond to both of those questions in\h
writing before your confirmation please\h\h

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yes ma'am okay well you know investigative\h
reporting is really a skill set and there are lots\h\h

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of moving parts when it comes to doing it right so\h
in this segment we're going to talk a little bit\h\h

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about how it works how ross did it in his book\h
in plain sight how he cultivated some of those\h\h

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sources and what kind of key sources and he had\h
and what they told them uh but you know ross uh\h\h

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i i did i have listened to so much of you recently\h
i i think i told you before the show i'm starting\h\h

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to dream in your voice and it's it's a little\h
frightening to me but i'm gonna continue for\h\h

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i because i've listened to these interviews you've\h
done and your book and all that um but i think the\h\h

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thing that i'd like to clear up most right now is\h
you know i don't want any barnacles of mythology\h\h

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growing up around you know how you came to do\h
this were you a dead skeptic and then you took\h\h

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years off and what's the story what was\h
your relationship to the uap slash ufo topic\h\h

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when you decided to write this book\h
and what made you decide to write it\h\h

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look like a lot of boys i guess as a as a little\h
kid i was fascinated i mean the 1960s when i was\h\h

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growing up was a period where there was a lot of\h
interest in ufos i mean people talked about it uh\h\h

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people wrote about it there were sightings all the\h
time where i was living in new zealand when i was\h\h

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16 years old there was the so-called kaikoura ufo\h
incident that was very dramatic because there was\h\h

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16 millimeter film taken by an australian reporter\h
and his new zealand cameraman uh the the reporter\h\h

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was quentin foggerty and the cameraman was davey\h
crockett and they uh they shot some extraordinary\h\h

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vision from a cargo plane on the north coast\h
of the south island of new zealand and i only\h\h

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found out later when i was at university i met\h
people who were working in air traffic control\h\h

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at wellington airport and i later on tracked\h
those people down and one of them john cordy\h\h

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who's still alive today lovely old geezer he\h
um he confirmed to me that contrary to what\h\h

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the new zealand air force said officially very\h
very shortly after the incident which is the i\h\h

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was i actually accepted the explanation at the\h
time the official explanation at the time that\h\h

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this was all rubbish that that essentially what\h
the pilot and what the two reporters on board\h\h

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had seen was just reflections of squid boat lights\h
off clouds and if it wasn't that it was venus but\h\h

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what was really interesting was to talk to this\h
air traffic controller who told me and he still\h\h

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tells me to this day he's adamant that what he saw\h
was solid and he was actually talking to the pilot\h\h

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on radio as they were seeing the object from the\h
front of the plane moving to the back of the plane\h\h

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coming up towards where the plane was at 14 000\h
feet and moving around the aircraft and this was\h\h

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being tracked on wellington radar and what was\h
really interesting was there was quite clearly\h\h

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a cover-up by the new zealand air force that to\h
this day has never been adequately explained and\h\h

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when you go through the new zealand archives and\h
which are available online and look at the report\h\h

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into the incident it's just appalling it was\h
just a complete whitewash and by complete\h\h

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chance when i came to australia i got to know\h
quentin fogerty who only died sadly last year\h\h

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and he was investigating this case all his life\h
and i guess that twigged my interest greatly\h\h

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but bryce as you'd know one of the things that\h
happens in journalism one of the first things\h\h

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that happens a lot of people think journals\h
get told not to do certain stories that there\h\h

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are certain stories that you're not allowed to do\h
that's actually not true except for one issue and\h\h

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that one issue is ufos i've been intrigued all\h
the way through my career how editors executive\h\h

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producers of tv programs fairly consistently have\h
treated the subject of ufos uaps with ridicule and\h\h

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derision and with a stigma and a taboo they're\h
frightened of it and i was always throughout\h\h

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my career i was pitching stories because i can\h
remember i was on the desk of the sydney morning\h\h

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herald on a sunday and people were calling there\h
was a woman calling saying she'd seen a flying\h\h

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saucer she was hanging out her washing in\h
parramatta which is a a suburb in sydney\h\h

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and she said she had a photograph of it and i\h
very naively said to the editor when he came in at\h\h

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about four o'clock i said ah sir there's a there's\h
a woman in parramatta who says that she's got\h\h

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a ufo picture and he looked at me with disdain and\h
said ross we don't do ufo stories and i remember\h\h

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thinking why because all through my career\h
i've done 35 years now plus in investigative\h\h

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journalism and tv news and newspapers and\h
radio and all through my career i've met people\h\h

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military pilots senior people in the air force\h
people and intelligence people and defense people\h\h

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in air accident investigations people working in\h
government who've told me they're aware of these\h\h

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objects they've seen these objects and that they\h
can't explain them so and i i i it perplexed me\h\h

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i just want to clarify by the way we get told a\h
lot of reasons there you didn't see what you saw\h\h

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maybe it was venus it might have been a weather\h
balloon but squid boat lights is really a great\h\h

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australian invention i love the squid boat light\h
uh explanation listen i just want to clarify this\h\h

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so it would be inappropriate to say that you were\h
a hardcore skeptic you had heard about the topic\h\h

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you had even covered it in some ways had thought\h
it was a worthy story and you wanted to chase it\h\h

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well i'll be honest when the when the new\h
zealand story about kaikoura first surfaced\h\h

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i was immediately accepting i guess i was a\h
bit more credulous back then i immediately\h\h

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accepted the air force explanation and i i i'm\h
not proud of it to be perfectly honest because\h\h

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i i didn't analyze it enough and then i i was\h
working for the new zealand herald newspaper\h\h

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uh in the years after that story and i can\h
remember people were really angry that there\h\h

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had been in their words a cover-up about\h
kaikoura and i remember i treated them with\h\h

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the disdain that we were taught to treat them\h
as journalists i used to laugh about ufo stories\h\h

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and and when people rang up saying that they'd\h
had experiences with ufos which did happen\h\h

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very very often sadly normally at a full moon\h
um i treated it with disrespect and i didn't\h\h

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accept what people were telling me was true\h
and now i feel kind of ashamed of that because\h\h

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i've i've looked in the archives and i've seen\h
what the new zealand government and the australian\h\h

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government and the american british french\h
governments knew and didn't reveal you know um\h\h

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that's all a good explanation uh the other thing\h
i noticed reading your book uh these multiple\h\h

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times is there is some parody with the australian\h
stories and the american stories which is as it\h\h

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should be because we're dealing with a global\h
phenomena and so it's very very interesting to\h\h

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see that but my question was when you started\h
to write this book because your book has uh has\h\h

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such a insight and is telling the story literally\h
through many stories that we haven't heard here in\h\h

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the united states some of these australian stories\h
were you writing the book originally for the\h\h

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australian market and then it got larger on you\h
or were you trying to educate the american market\h\h

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look i have a confession to make i\h
actually started out thinking of the\h\h

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international story first i was really interested\h
in the history of america and and i i'd read a lot\h\h

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of the books i'd read timothy good's i think\h
excellent books on the history and then uh my\h\h

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publisher they said to me they said look ross we\h
want to know a bit more about australia and i was\h\h

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only sort of halfway through at that stage and\h
i've looked i i didn't know how much there was\h\h

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in the australian archives and so i went down to\h
canberra which is about an hour from where i live\h\h

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and i sat down in the national archives in\h
canberra and started going through the air force\h\h

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investigation files into ufos unidentified objects\h
and i was gobsmacked because there's a history\h\h

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there a rich history and there was a moment for\h
me that was a real turning point there's a mate of\h\h

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mine here in australia bill chalker who's probably\h
australia's preeminent ufo uap researcher and bill\h\h

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told me about a defense department scientist\h
called harry turner who'd written a report in the\h\h

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early 1970s requesting the australian government\h
to consider essentially a ufo investigation team\h\h

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uh you know kind of like a project blue book\h
in australia and he pushed really hard to his\h\h

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defense commanders basically arguing that quote\h
it was quite clear that there'd been a cover-up\h\h

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of the ufo issue in america that the u.s air\h
force knew a lot more than it was letting on\h\h

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and this was a defense department senior scientist\h
who as it turned out when i went through the files\h\h

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o h turner harry turner was oh turner who back\h
in the 1950s and the 1960s was a young physicist\h\h

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who had witnessed ufos and investigated them over\h
the nuclear weapons test sites in south australia\h\h

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at places called maralinga and which were super\h
secret sites a bit like our groom lake area 51\h\h

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where we were collaborating with the us to assist\h
in the testing of icbm missile technology and\h\h

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nuclear missiles and indeed during those tests\h
there was a plethora of weird sightings of\h\h

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disc shaped lenticular craft whatever it was it\h
wasn't just taking an active interest in what was\h\h

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happening in america it was taking a very close\h
interest in nuclear weapons testing all around\h\h

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the world and including here in australia\h
that's what made it so fascinating to read\h\h

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it filled in gaps it showed similarities uh it the\h
narrative one realized was if it wasn't happening\h\h

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here it was happening there it just it didn't\h
like go away it was being practiced everywhere\h\h

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let me just jump into the journalism\h
part of this a little deeper here though\h\h

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obviously as you said you've had a long\h
career and you've won some awards as a\h\h

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investigative journalist and it's\h
pretty cool that that's all true\h\h

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what kind of things did you learn what tactics\h
what methodology did you apply that had worked\h\h

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on other stories that was particularly useful to\h
you when trying to break open the uap storyline

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one of the things i learned very early on was\h
to protect sources uh i i realized one of the\h\h

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been a moment i was working for australia's\h
top public affairs show called four corners\h\h

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which is like our pbs frontline equivalent in\h
australia and um i was an investigative reporter\h\h

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on that show and i was investigating a story that\h
related to the australian air force and because\h\h

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we were a high-profile program we were being\h
given very good access by very senior officers\h\h

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in the australian air force and we were filming\h
with them spending days with them and sitting in\h\h

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the office's mess at the end of the day having\h
a beer and on one of those days i was with two\h\h

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very very senior officers and one of them said to\h
me why why don't you chaps do stories about ufos\h\h

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and i i just left i i freely admit i just said\h
well because most of them are [\h__\h] aren't they\h\h

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and he went no they're not no and then in\h
the course of this very very weird evening\h\h

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we drank a few beers and and he he introduced\h
me to pilots who were coming through the mess\h\h

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and a lot of them were fighter\h
pilots a lot of them were um\h\h

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transport or uh surveillance aircraft pilots every\h
single one of the people that he introduced me to\h\h

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had a story about anomalous objects and i said to\h
them why don't you report them and some of them\h\h

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had in fact and when i went through the australian\h
archives i could actually find some of the reports\h\h

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and what what interested me was that i realized we\h
as media we need to protect these people because\h\h

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for them the thing that was concerning them the\h
first thing they asked me was you're not going to\h\h

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report my name are you you're not you're not going\h
to say who i am and i'd go no no of course not i'm\h\h

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just i'm just chatting to you know this is one\h
of your commanding offices you know feel free to\h\h

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you can talk to me off the record and they were\h
all saying to me look there's a stigma associated\h\h

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with this you know we don't like talking about\h
it publicly but but seriously if you protect us\h\h

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as sources we'll tell you what we know but i think\h
they did i think that's one of your the issues\h\h

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that i want to hear a little bit more about here's\h
the the thing yes i get protecting your sources\h\h

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and that's what an investigative reporter has to\h
do or you don't have any sources for very long\h\h

327
00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:18,080
however you know you did you are able\h
to name certain sources nat kobits was a\h\h

328
00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:22,480
excellent source for you and you talked\h
about some other people but also in your book\h\h

329
00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:27,520
in terms of protecting the sources you had to\h
give people names like the space man and and\h\h

330
00:32:27,520 --> 00:32:32,640
cranium and you know you gave you gave people some\h
names and i'm not saying there's anything wrong\h\h

331
00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:37,680
with that i mean obviously woodward and bernstein\h
had to do that with deep throat and yet that was\h\h

332
00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:42,960
used against them in many cases people would say\h
well how do we really know i mean they're they're\h\h

333
00:32:42,960 --> 00:32:47,840
quoting this guy named [\h__\h] who is he what do\h
we really know about the guy turned out he was\h\h

334
00:32:47,840 --> 00:32:54,400
uh high up in the fbi at the time but that's\h
another story does it hurt when these people\h\h

335
00:32:55,360 --> 00:32:59,840
don't want to go on the record and do you\h
at least after you gain their confidence\h\h

336
00:32:59,840 --> 00:33:04,480
work hard to get them to go on the record\h
and do you use these names as a last resort

337
00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:12,640
it does and i wish i could persuade more of these\h
people to go on the record what's been really\h\h

338
00:33:12,640 --> 00:33:19,360
interesting in the last few months since the\h
uap task force report was tabled in the congress\h\h

339
00:33:19,360 --> 00:33:23,840
one of the things i've been asking the people\h
that i engage with especially people in the us\h\h

340
00:33:23,840 --> 00:33:31,920
is would you be prepared if you were asked to\h
volunteer information to a congressional hearing\h\h

341
00:33:31,920 --> 00:33:38,480
would you give evidence and they've said firstly\h
yes but only if i was released from the terms of\h\h

342
00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:44,480
my security oath because a lot of people have\h
told me they know things but they are bound by\h\h

343
00:33:44,480 --> 00:33:51,840
their security oath that they've sworn to the u.s\h
defense department to essentially lie to deceive\h\h

344
00:33:51,840 --> 00:33:59,120
i was amused just recently um lou uh elizondo who\h
i admire greatly by the way but he did say in one\h\h

345
00:33:59,120 --> 00:34:06,560
podcast recently that um he wasn't allowed to lie\h
but there is one exception if you are a person\h\h

346
00:34:06,560 --> 00:34:13,440
who's aware of a waived unacknowledged special\h
access program you're obliged to lie you have\h\h

347
00:34:13,440 --> 00:34:20,960
to conceal the existence of that sap it's a secret\h
that is so vital to us national security that you\h\h

348
00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:26,240
have to lie about it and i've spoken to people\h
who've told me that they are in that position\h\h

349
00:34:26,240 --> 00:34:32,880
but they want to testify so i only hope that\h
people like senator christian gillibrand whose\h\h

350
00:34:32,880 --> 00:34:37,680
picture i should really have on my wall behind\h
me here because she's done such a phenomenal job\h\h

351
00:34:37,680 --> 00:34:43,360
in in pushing this issue and making bureaucrats\h
realize that they have to be accountable i just\h\h

352
00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:50,480
hope that the congress when the report comes\h
in towards the end of this year recognizes the\h\h

353
00:34:50,480 --> 00:34:56,720
need to facilitate people to be allowed to give\h
evidence under oath with a protection from their\h\h

354
00:34:56,720 --> 00:35:03,360
security oaths i totally agree by the way people\h
that have followed us regularly during our first\h\h

355
00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:08,400
seven episodes know that we haven't done guests\h
we try to keep it short punchy and and give you\h\h

356
00:35:08,400 --> 00:35:13,360
the news you need and and kick it around fast and\h
furious but if we do have a first guest i'm gonna\h\h

357
00:35:13,360 --> 00:35:20,400
vote for senator gillibrand and i would think\h
that would be a terrific uh reason to break that\h\h

358
00:35:20,400 --> 00:35:26,160
policy and we'd let her go as long as she wanted\h
if she wanted to talk about uap because she's in\h\h

359
00:35:26,160 --> 00:35:31,120
the center of the storm right now okay look we're\h
going to wrap up just one thing one thing i just\h\h

360
00:35:31,120 --> 00:35:36,560
want to emphasize there's votes for politicians\h
in backing this issue and you and i know that as\h\h

361
00:35:36,560 --> 00:35:41,120
well yes of course it's a popular issue so we're\h
going to wrap up here in this segment we've got\h\h

362
00:35:41,120 --> 00:35:45,520
one final segment and when we come back the\h
thing i want to focus on with ross is that\h\h

363
00:35:46,640 --> 00:35:52,400
he spent a lot of time doing the research he\h
traveled the distance he had a journey and he\h\h

364
00:35:52,400 --> 00:35:57,200
reached a few conclusions i want to ask him about\h
some of those conclusions because they informed\h\h

365
00:35:57,200 --> 00:36:11,840
the work that we're doing together on need\h
to know so stick with us we'll be right back\h\h

366
00:36:13,840 --> 00:36:19,840
i i uh yeah i got to be a little careful\h
here i always say this i think that there is\h\h

367
00:36:21,840 --> 00:36:23,680
absolutely has been\h\h

368
00:36:25,440 --> 00:36:32,720
uh visitors from other places on this planet\h
visitors from like not on this planet aliens just\h\h

369
00:36:33,360 --> 00:36:38,720
of one do they um do that you're talking about\h
roswell i don't want to talk do they carry ideas

370
00:36:41,200 --> 00:36:47,520
you can't call them space aliens you just have to\h
call them non-human undocumented people i think\h\h

371
00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:53,760
that i think there's been things found in the\h
world that have been from outer space that have\h\h

372
00:36:53,760 --> 00:36:59,200
been kept quiet like what keith olbermann\h
he'll tell it maybe there will be one day\h\h

373
00:37:00,240 --> 00:37:05,200
he's actually bigfoot you know in a way i think\h
ross's strength has been that he's been able to\h\h

374
00:37:05,200 --> 00:37:10,640
be a surrogate for a lot of people in in this\h
journey that he's taken them on in his book\h\h

375
00:37:10,640 --> 00:37:16,320
and and let people sort of see some of what\h
he's been seeing and and go through that process\h\h

376
00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:22,160
the average person in my view doesn't have\h
the time to really do these deep dives and\h\h

377
00:37:22,160 --> 00:37:26,000
in fact that's probably one of the reasons we're\h
doing need to know and it was certainly one of\h\h

378
00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:31,120
the reasons why i think ross your book was so\h
popular this year for last year and this year\h\h

379
00:37:31,120 --> 00:37:36,000
because people thought well he's treating\h
my time respectfully and he's done the work\h\h

380
00:37:36,000 --> 00:37:41,360
that i would have liked to have seen so\h
you know as we begin here i noticed that\h\h

381
00:37:42,000 --> 00:37:45,520
you know if you if i were to describe\h
the structure of your book the first\h\h

382
00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:51,280
half felt like almost like a historical review to\h
me which i thought was very useful because a lot\h\h

383
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:55,680
of people don't know the history of the topic\h
and then i felt like the investigative part\h\h

384
00:37:55,680 --> 00:38:01,760
kind of kicked in in the second half and it you\h
didn't really sort of lay out that final chapter\h\h

385
00:38:01,760 --> 00:38:08,000
that said okay here's my conclusions in fact\h
your final chapter was uh was titled something\h\h

386
00:38:08,000 --> 00:38:14,800
about salvation i don't know how to pronounce his\h
name salvatore pais is that correct why did you\h\h

387
00:38:14,800 --> 00:38:20,880
end on that guy what was it about that that felt\h
like it saw it pulled it all together for you

388
00:38:23,120 --> 00:38:30,080
in many ways bryce writing the book has been\h
a case for me of stating the legitimacy of\h\h

389
00:38:30,080 --> 00:38:36,560
the mystery because we've been told for 75\h
years 77 years that this is not an issue\h\h

390
00:38:36,560 --> 00:38:40,960
that we should take seriously that we should\h
treat it with ridicule and treat it with taboo\h\h

391
00:38:41,760 --> 00:38:48,000
so i started the book the historical part of\h
the book to underline what i think fantastic\h\h

392
00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:54,160
people like uh rick dolan and his book uh and\h
you in fact with after after disclosure as well\h\h

393
00:38:54,160 --> 00:39:01,120
and uh timothy good with his books there's been\h
a solid skein of evidence revealed by witness\h\h

394
00:39:01,120 --> 00:39:10,160
statements and crucially official documents that\h
underline there is evidence quote in plain sight\h\h

395
00:39:10,800 --> 00:39:19,680
that i felt was an absolute revelation to me i\h
i wasn't aware of the the the incredible detail\h\h

396
00:39:19,680 --> 00:39:25,920
that supports the legitimacy that whatever\h
this is this mystery this phenomenon is real\h\h

397
00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:31,200
so i that's why i structured it the way\h
i structured it i wanted the the reader\h\h

398
00:39:31,200 --> 00:39:39,440
to come into the the book and go okay this isn't\h
an airy fairy tinfoil hat loony sort of subject\h\h

399
00:39:39,440 --> 00:39:47,600
matter this is verified there are so many reports\h
in history that underline the legitimacy of this\h\h

400
00:39:48,960 --> 00:39:55,840
and then throughout my investigation i guess i\h
tried to treat it like a road trip because it's\h\h

401
00:39:55,840 --> 00:40:01,520
been as much of a discovery and an uncovering for\h
me as i hope it is for the reader that's reading\h\h

402
00:40:01,520 --> 00:40:08,560
the book you know i'm taking them on a journey and\h
so the reason i used the salvatori payee uh story\h\h

403
00:40:08,560 --> 00:40:16,880
he's a navy scientist who the u.s navy on behalf\h
of him filed patents making extraordinary claims\h\h

404
00:40:16,880 --> 00:40:25,760
that they have operable force field generator\h
technology trans-medium vehicles fusion generators\h\h

405
00:40:25,760 --> 00:40:32,080
and this series of quite extraordinary\h
patent applications were made by the us navy\h\h

406
00:40:32,080 --> 00:40:39,680
in public patents just a few years ago and i was\h
intrigued i was absolutely fascinated that the us\h\h

407
00:40:39,680 --> 00:40:48,000
navy felt able to assert and swear and testify to\h
the patent office that these patents are operable\h\h

408
00:40:48,720 --> 00:40:55,040
they made a representation that as a lawyer\h
myself i know that if that representation is\h\h

409
00:40:55,040 --> 00:41:02,800
false then the patent is invalid so to me what\h
i was doing was underlining that i do think\h\h

410
00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:09,040
the united states government has now officially\h
acknowledged it knows more than it's letting on\h\h

411
00:41:09,600 --> 00:41:16,160
and at the heart of what my book was concluding is\h
that fact that there is a mystery here that i know\h\h

412
00:41:16,160 --> 00:41:23,280
know the united states government is sitting on\h
and for the moment at least it's concealing well\h\h

413
00:41:23,280 --> 00:41:29,120
in fact that i was going to say that the one thing\h
that is extremely clear from your book and you say\h\h

414
00:41:29,120 --> 00:41:34,560
it in the final chapter and this is a quote i have\h
no doubt at all that the u.s government is hiding\h\h

415
00:41:34,560 --> 00:41:40,960
extraordinary secrets about the phenomenon and i i\h
think that um that kind of goes in line with what\h\h

416
00:41:40,960 --> 00:41:45,840
i've been telling people they go well you know can\h
you prove ufos are real i go well i can't prove\h\h

417
00:41:45,840 --> 00:41:50,800
that they're they're extraterrestrial anything\h
but i can i can i think prove that they're real\h\h

418
00:41:50,800 --> 00:41:56,400
but i can certainly prove the cover-up i think\h
the cover-up is is the first rail of proof\h\h

419
00:41:57,760 --> 00:42:02,080
yep i agree with you and i i think the issue\h
with the whole roswell case for example\h\h

420
00:42:02,080 --> 00:42:07,680
on which you'd note i've stayed agnostic i haven't\h
reached a definitive conclusion about roswell but\h\h

421
00:42:07,680 --> 00:42:14,400
the one thing i'm certain about is if this really\h
was a weather balloon or some kind of cold war spy\h\h

422
00:42:14,400 --> 00:42:22,400
balloon the level of cover-up by the us air force\h
that continues today is completely unjustified\h\h

423
00:42:22,400 --> 00:42:27,920
and it's disproportionate to the information that\h
they were trying to conceal or that they purport\h\h

424
00:42:27,920 --> 00:42:34,080
to have been trying to conceal and this is a\h
consistent pattern that frankly the one thing\h\h

425
00:42:34,080 --> 00:42:40,160
we can be sure of is that whatever the secret\h
is they're trying to hide something that they\h\h

426
00:42:40,160 --> 00:42:46,880
haven't yet revealed and i keep on coming back\h
to telling moments in recent history where\h\h

427
00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:54,960
for example president obama actually told jimmy\h
kimmel when he was asked about aliens in all\h\h

428
00:42:54,960 --> 00:43:01,360
seriousness he said i can't talk about that what\h
was it and why the hell aren't mainstream media\h\h

429
00:43:01,360 --> 00:43:08,320
asking in the united states why can't president\h
obama if if aliens are all bs if it's all nonsense\h\h

430
00:43:09,280 --> 00:43:14,160
why can't the president talk about it pretty good\h
why can't he just dismissively say look i've been\h\h

431
00:43:14,160 --> 00:43:19,680
briefed on this and there's just nothing to\h
it they can't say that anymore donald trump\h\h

432
00:43:19,680 --> 00:43:26,560
president donald trump a few weeks before the end\h
of his term told his junior don jr that there were\h\h

433
00:43:26,560 --> 00:43:33,200
things he knew about roswell that he couldn't talk\h
about why i mean why can't we talk about it what\h\h

434
00:43:33,200 --> 00:43:37,440
is it they're still concealing i want to go back\h
and quote you again to yourself that's one of my\h\h

435
00:43:37,440 --> 00:43:44,880
favorite things to do so um you said at the end\h
i strongly suspect from what my own sources tell\h\h

436
00:43:44,880 --> 00:43:50,720
me that technology not made by human hands has\h
been recovered and this is the part that got me\h\h

437
00:43:51,520 --> 00:43:58,960
not only by the us but by russia and china so my\h
question to you is if that's what you concluded\h\h

438
00:43:58,960 --> 00:44:05,120
do you think we're in the middle of some kind\h
of alien space tech race that has been going on\h\h

439
00:44:05,120 --> 00:44:10,960
under cover uh that but that is the equivalent\h
to the space race we had in the 50s and 60s\h\h

440
00:44:12,720 --> 00:44:16,480
yes i do i actually do\h
think that i've been told by

441
00:44:19,920 --> 00:44:26,720
two united states intelligence sources\h
that the russians have definitely retrieved\h\h

442
00:44:26,720 --> 00:44:33,920
a craft and that the word that was used in\h
relation to china was they've retrieved technology\h\h

443
00:44:33,920 --> 00:44:41,840
possibly archaeological now i don't really care\h
if my friends in mainstream media titter or\h\h

444
00:44:41,840 --> 00:44:47,920
you know resort to ridicule but before they do\h
they should really look at what's being said by\h\h

445
00:44:48,720 --> 00:44:53,840
senior officials that have suddenly as you and\h
i noted in our last podcast you know there's\h\h

446
00:44:53,840 --> 00:45:00,320
been a huge sea change in the way that official\h
washington is talking about this issue there are\h\h

447
00:45:00,320 --> 00:45:06,080
people creditable people like christopher mellon\h
former deputy assistant secretary of defense\h\h

448
00:45:06,080 --> 00:45:11,600
louis lozando the former head of the ufo program\h
inside usd the office of the under secretary of\h\h

449
00:45:11,600 --> 00:45:21,040
defense intelligence and security um dr eric\h
davis uh dr hal put off these are creditable\h\h

450
00:45:21,040 --> 00:45:27,280
people who are intelligent well respected making\h
the assertion that they believe the united states\h\h

451
00:45:27,280 --> 00:45:32,480
is in possession of non-human technology\h
and some of them have implied or asserted\h\h

452
00:45:32,480 --> 00:45:37,520
that there is indeed an ongoing back engineering\h
and reverse engineering program now that's what\h\h

453
00:45:37,520 --> 00:45:44,240
my source nat coverts went on the record with\h
before he died and told me on the record that\h\h

454
00:45:44,240 --> 00:45:51,040
as the former director of science and technology\h
for the u.s navy he'd been read into a reverse\h\h

455
00:45:51,040 --> 00:46:01,600
engineering program involving multiple retrieved\h
non-human spacecraft now there comes a time when\h\h

456
00:46:02,480 --> 00:46:11,280
the question has to be asked when do we start\h
saying okay the media the mainstream media needs\h\h

457
00:46:11,280 --> 00:46:17,200
to start jumping on the bandwagon and asking\h
hard questions about this because there's been\h\h

458
00:46:17,200 --> 00:46:23,840
one feeble attempt at a pentagon press conference\h
just not long ago actually and what i found very\h\h

459
00:46:23,840 --> 00:46:29,120
very very interesting was that the the pentagon\h
spokesman when they were asked you know does the\h\h

460
00:46:29,120 --> 00:46:33,760
united states have retrieved alien spacecraft\h
it's one of the first times that question's\h\h

461
00:46:33,760 --> 00:46:41,200
been asked you know what the spokesman did he\h
avoided the question yeah he didn't answer it if

462
00:46:44,400 --> 00:46:49,920
yeah and so i mean i i just think it's\h
time i i know from talking to sources\h\h

463
00:46:50,800 --> 00:46:56,560
that either a hell of a lot of people in defense\h
intelligence and private aerospace are lying\h\h

464
00:46:57,840 --> 00:47:01,120
or the united states government has been lied to\h\h

465
00:47:01,120 --> 00:47:06,720
i want to jump to you know by the way if you do\h
read ross's book don't jump to the end and read\h\h

466
00:47:06,720 --> 00:47:12,080
the last page you'll get all the good stuff that's\h
what i do don't you always read the last page\h\h

467
00:47:12,960 --> 00:47:18,080
one thing i want to quote you did say too many\h
because you've got all these sources not every\h\h

468
00:47:18,080 --> 00:47:22,560
source you talk to has made it in your book and\h
there's been many sources that have talked to you\h\h

469
00:47:22,560 --> 00:47:28,400
since your book so you state too many insiders\h
have dropped too many hints for me not to think\h\h

470
00:47:28,400 --> 00:47:34,240
that there is a reckoning coming so as we\h
wrap this segment up and this this podcast up\h\h

471
00:47:35,280 --> 00:47:41,840
what do you think is a reckoning what does\h
reckoning mean when it comes to uap ufo reality\h\h

472
00:47:43,120 --> 00:47:49,520
okay my take on this price is very simple i think\h
that we are only going to see a very controlled\h\h

473
00:47:49,520 --> 00:47:56,000
narrative that misleadingly suggests that the us\h
has just discovered it will make a concession i\h\h

474
00:47:56,000 --> 00:48:01,280
suspect that it has just discovered something\h
that makes them think that there is non-human\h\h

475
00:48:01,280 --> 00:48:07,920
life on this planet or that has been visiting\h
this planet i don't think the us wants to admit\h\h

476
00:48:08,560 --> 00:48:13,840
it's longer history i don't think it ever\h
wants to admit that it's got crash retrievals\h\h

477
00:48:13,840 --> 00:48:17,920
that it's been running a back engineering\h
program and i think what they're trying to do\h\h

478
00:48:17,920 --> 00:48:22,880
and frankly i would do the same thing i think\h
what they're trying to do is fence that off\h\h

479
00:48:23,440 --> 00:48:28,800
because it's so important to the national security\h
of the united states the technology that they're\h\h

480
00:48:28,800 --> 00:48:34,720
deriving from that that they're seeking to employ\h
from that and it's still i understand an active\h\h

481
00:48:34,720 --> 00:48:40,080
investigation active research they don't want to\h
talk about it so i think what we're going to see\h\h

482
00:48:40,080 --> 00:48:46,640
later this year is a concession that yes as we've\h
told you this mystery is real we now believe\h\h

483
00:48:46,640 --> 00:48:50,400
i think they might actually concede this\h
you know there is a non-human intelligence\h\h

484
00:48:50,400 --> 00:48:54,320
that's engaging with humanity we\h
do think that this is a technology\h\h

485
00:48:54,320 --> 00:48:59,360
and we do think that it's intelligently controlled\h
and we don't think that it's russian or chinese\h\h

486
00:49:00,000 --> 00:49:04,400
but i think that might be affected by what's\h
happening in the ukraine i think we're moving\h\h

487
00:49:04,400 --> 00:49:10,160
into such a dangerous period on this planet you\h
know the technology and the weaponry held by the\h\h

488
00:49:10,160 --> 00:49:15,680
united states is going to be incredibly important\h
in the next 12 months we've got the possibility of\h\h

489
00:49:15,680 --> 00:49:21,920
war with china we've got the looming threat in\h
the ukraine and then there's also that sleeping\h\h

490
00:49:21,920 --> 00:49:25,760
issue of whether or not iran is going\h
to be allowed to have a nuclear weapon\h\h

491
00:49:26,720 --> 00:49:31,200
you know we are in such dangerous times and i\h
think all of that is going to affect whether\h\h

492
00:49:31,200 --> 00:49:38,240
or not the public gets told anything really of\h
substance as brian williams used to always say\h\h

493
00:49:38,240 --> 00:49:44,880
on his uh 11th hour show it's a lot and it is\h
a lot i want to end with a personal question\h\h

494
00:49:45,680 --> 00:49:51,280
on this journey of yours you you have family\h
you have kids you have a wife uh as they've\h\h

495
00:49:51,280 --> 00:49:59,200
seen you become further and further involved\h
in this investigation how have they reacted\h\h

496
00:49:59,200 --> 00:50:04,800
what do they think about what you are doing\h
with your with your energy and with your time\h\h

497
00:50:06,640 --> 00:50:11,680
they've been incredibly supportive i mean i i take\h
my hat off to them they've been very open-minded\h\h

498
00:50:11,680 --> 00:50:17,200
and very very supportive i think they're nervous\h
because you know i'm a i'm a mainstream journalist\h\h

499
00:50:17,200 --> 00:50:21,520
with some reputation and they're worried that\h
originally they might have been worried that it\h\h

500
00:50:21,520 --> 00:50:26,720
was damaging my credibility but i think everybody\h
in my family have just been incredibly supportive\h\h

501
00:50:26,720 --> 00:50:32,000
because they've basically seen that what i'm\h
talking about has evidence they've heard me\h\h

502
00:50:32,000 --> 00:50:37,200
off the record talking to sources they've they've\h
heard me talking to people in the intelligence\h\h

503
00:50:37,200 --> 00:50:41,040
community one of my daughters laughed the\h
other day and she said oh is that your\h\h

504
00:50:41,040 --> 00:50:46,400
is that your spy friend daddy and uh you know it's\h
nice because they're aware that i'm talking to a\h\h

505
00:50:46,400 --> 00:50:52,000
wide range of different people who are happy to\h
talk to me off the record and what's interesting\h\h

506
00:50:52,000 --> 00:50:58,000
is this has happened as well with my friends the\h
people who used to treat with disdain and ridicule\h\h

507
00:50:58,000 --> 00:51:03,920
the idea that there are things called ufos\h
or uaps they're now coming around because\h\h

508
00:51:03,920 --> 00:51:07,840
they're reading the reports that are now\h
starting to dribble into the mainstream media\h\h

509
00:51:08,640 --> 00:51:13,840
and they're they're seeing they've watched my\h
documentary uh the ufo phenomenon which is on the\h\h

510
00:51:13,840 --> 00:51:19,280
seven spotlight youtube site and i think they've\h
realized that there are people of reputation that\h\h

511
00:51:19,280 --> 00:51:25,520
are behind the claims that i'm making and all i'm\h
doing really is what a journalist should do citing\h\h

512
00:51:25,520 --> 00:51:33,040
the evidence and following the leads you know i\h
i i thank you for that honest answer about that\h\h

513
00:51:33,040 --> 00:51:38,880
uh i i hope your family feels confident enough to\h
actually listen to your podcast once in a while\h\h

514
00:51:39,520 --> 00:51:45,760
let me know about that listen i enjoyed prepping\h
for this particular show because it allowed me\h\h

515
00:51:45,760 --> 00:51:52,000
a chance to revisit it i did review your book\h
when it first came out on trail of the saucers\h\h

516
00:51:52,000 --> 00:51:57,920
um and it was a fast read and it was a fast\h
it was what they call a hot take and so it\h\h

517
00:51:57,920 --> 00:52:03,360
was really interesting for me knowing you as\h
a person uh working with you professionally\h\h

518
00:52:03,360 --> 00:52:08,720
to read it again and i have to say uh i'm\h
speaking to the people listening to this or\h\h

519
00:52:08,720 --> 00:52:13,600
watching this it's a hell of a read and it's\h
not just a hell of a read because it's um\h\h

520
00:52:14,160 --> 00:52:19,440
it's got all this information in it it's a hell\h
of a read because it's very personal it's kind\h\h

521
00:52:19,440 --> 00:52:25,600
of funny sometimes and it's it's kind of charming\h
and it's kind of real and i'll be honest with you\h\h

522
00:52:25,600 --> 00:52:31,840
i started by saying i've read the book as an\h
e-book as a soft cover book and as an audiobook\h\h

523
00:52:32,640 --> 00:52:37,840
and i guess ross if you put it out as an\h
nft i'm going to have to read it again but\h\h

524
00:52:40,000 --> 00:52:45,760
i really enjoyed this and i look forward to\h
talking to you about new new matters in uap coming\h\h

525
00:52:45,760 --> 00:52:51,680
forward in the future thanks for the opportunity\h
bryce it's weird being interviewed by you but uh\h\h

526
00:52:51,680 --> 00:52:55,680
i i've enjoyed it very very much and i thought\h
you asked some great questions well i'll tell\h\h

527
00:52:55,680 --> 00:53:00,320
you folks we'll see you all soon remember if you\h
want to know how to find the podcast or how to\h\h

528
00:53:00,320 --> 00:53:06,960
find the video version it's a one-stop shop you go\h
to need to know dot today need to know dot today\h\h

529
00:53:07,840 --> 00:53:12,080
it's all out there in plain\h
sight so that's it for now\h\h

530
00:53:12,080 --> 00:53:27,840
we're done for today remember we can\h
handle the truth people get ready

531
00:53:39,680 --> 00:53:41,840
you want to be

532
00:53:46,560 --> 00:53:55,840
tell me

533
00:54:22,560 --> 00:54:37,840
you say too much to learn

534
00:54:55,920 --> 00:55:05,840
tell me

535
00:55:21,120 --> 00:55:33,840
you say it will blow my mind

536
00:55:34,480 --> 00:55:47,840
things will fall apart no more fears

537
00:55:59,920 --> 00:56:01,840
tell me

538
00:56:25,120 --> 00:56:29,840
do we see the future

539
00:56:54,160 --> 00:56:57,840
this is

540
00:57:10,960 --> 00:57:15,120
news mystery solved those eerie\h
lights just a lost weather balloon\h\h

541
00:57:15,120 --> 00:57:25,840
an air force spokesman confirms tonight that\h
this was nosewine saucer sports is next says

542
00:57:37,840 --> 00:57:41,840
there's a whole fleet of on the assay oh my gosh

543
00:57:44,160 --> 00:57:53,840
they're all going against the\h
wind the wind's 120 knots west